Why did John Piper become a Calvinist? | Dr. Leighton Flowers | Soteriology 101

If we try to identify "doctrines of demons" I believe Augustinianism/Calvinism qualifies. It also seems clear from history that Augustine had some kind of experience or crisis that caused him to drastically change his theology after previously agreeing with early church teaching which led to aggressive persecution and misrepresentation of opponents. It is quite possible that a deceiving spirit affected him - perhaps because he was predisposed through his previous Manichaeism or his desire to eliminate opponents. When reading one of Piper's books, Future Grace, I had the experience of feeling quite happy about the main thesis proposed and large passages in it and then suddenly being disturbed by intrusive predestinarian passages that seemed of a different nature. It was as if a different person had written those. Some have commented on the cultish nature of Calvinism and I strongly suspect that one of the demons tasked with spreading false doctrine operated on Augustine and revisited Calvin, given his slavish devotion to the ancient "father". The demonic aspect explains the stubborn blindness of its devotees to its absurdities and frankly blasphemous claims about the character of God - as well as the sometimes unseemly mocking arrogance of some of their responses to reasoned discussion. Interestingly Spurgeon is a good example of someone who was mind was brainwashed by reading almost exclusively calvinistic material in his youth but whose great loving heart clearly could not fully compute it - so very much of his preaching appeals to the will of the hearer because he was communicating God's loving heart to them. I believe he now realises that his wonderful preaching was not merely God's method of collecting the already elect but rather his way of persuading the otherwise lost to repent and believe.

I agree completely with John Pipers opening. He holds Roman 9 and other "Calvinist" texts above all other Scripture and therefore overrides it. I also agree that it doesn't matter (to my belief) what he thinks

I did an informal research looking through the writings of Jonathan Edwards, George Whitefield, Cotton Mather and other influential Calvinists and most were reluctant to oppose American slavery based on the doctrine of predestination. Compare their writings with Free Will literature such as John Wesley and others. Some people did profit from the thought of subjecting a people group to centuries of cruelty and degradation because of Gods so called predestination and not man’s free will to choose evil

Look at the debate with Mormon apologists with Calvinist apologists with James White moderating… The end is embarrassing for the Calvinists because the Mormans began to expose the dangers of Calvinism and each objection to Calvinism was spot on

Please interview Steve Gregg.

Very interesting but too long. I had to break it up in 4 or 5 sessions. It would be nice to have shorter podcasts say in Part 1, Part 2, 3 and 4 etc. for busy people who can’t sit down for 2 or more hours at a time.

After listening to the entirety of Piper's sermon "The Absolute Sovereignty of God. What is Romans Nine All About?/Desiring God" I came to understand how Piper's conversion evolved. After months of careful study of scripture, Romans 9 specifically, he came to grasp God's sovereignty and the exaltation of God. The Lord spoke to him- "My sovereignty is not simply to be scrutinized, it is to be heralded. It is not grist for the mill of controversy, it is gospel for sinners who know that their only hope is the sovereign triumph of God’s grace over their rebellious will.”

If John Piper is a 7 point Calvinist then one thing is sure. He is not a very good speller.

Can I give a analogy of what it is for Calvinest preaching to reach lost people in church is like.
A man is getting married in a week. He gets up in church and says I am getting married this Saturday everyone come you are all invited. But in reality he has already sent out RSVP to the people he invited and they have already committed to coming. But the people that were not invited don't know this. So the uninvited people show up to the wedding and they get turned away. Because they were not really invited . So the guy who invited everyone was lying to the people who were not really invited. Just like what the Calvinest really believes.

Does Leighton and Waren believe in despensation thelogy?

Come on John Piper viewed Roman 9 as it is, a ♠️ is a ♠️, you don’t like it ! God bless you! 🙏🙏🙏

Can't join Ole Neville Goddard is best and free truth.

3 hours? 😂😂😂

You may like and respect Piper but the bible says he's accursed. In case we don't know what accurssd means:
ACCURS'ED, pp. or a.
1. Doomed to destruction or misery:
2. Separated from the faithful; cast out of the church; excommunicated.
3. Worthy of the curse; detestable; execrable.
Keep from the accursed thing. Josh. 6.
Hence,
4. Wicked; malignant in the extreme.

How can you say that John Piper is a good pastor? You do a good job at pointing out how terrible and heretical Calvinism is and then say someone that is a hyper Calvinist is a good pastor? That blows my mind.

This is what pretty much happened to John Piper:
Colossians 2:8
[8]Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

John Piper is a humble man, open mind than most of the Calvinists, he ponder than many things more than you guys, you are totally humanistic!🙏🙏🙏

Has anyone here ever heard of the Zone of Proximal Development? The ZPD? Its a principle of child development (let me look it up, because I can't remember the name of the child psychologist who put this forward, although he's a favorite. Lev Vygotsky, social psychologist who was once hailed by Soviet Russia, until they understood that the kind of "social" he meant was the benefit to childen of close, nurturing family relationships. Not cool, said Stalin.) I just keep thinking of this. The ZPD is defined as the difference in what a child can do without help, and what they can do with help. 'Scaffolding" is a Vygotskyan concept, although I can't remember who coined th as t either. The point is, it IS a "thing", and I find that this particular everyday concept has a way of disappearing in these vitriolic, win at any cost arguments. It is God who works in our faith, but for crying out loud, because He's far more honest and just than we are, He doesn't do the part that that He holds us accountable for. He persuades us, undergirds ("scaffolds") our spiritual development, but does not force even the right choices on us, much less does He force us to choose wrongly. "Behold, I stand at the door and knock": this shows what it's like when we "give God permission" to act in our behalf. When we choose, it is in the context of God having asked us to choose. It's His idea, not ours. After all, Jesus didnt say "just so you'll know, I'm getting ready to knock down the door and do my sovereign will, which you cannot thwart by 'opening the door'..." He also says nowhere that God wants people to do evil, much less that He forces them to do evil.

Thanks for your time in equipping the saints to understand the whole counsel of God in a way that is consistent with his character of Love and Mercy rather than Controlling and Cruel.

Anyone else's skin crawl when they hear Warren talk? Can't stand him after his videos denying Christ's substitutionary atonement.

Unbelievers can believe or not. Believers can obey or not. Limited free will!!!

What about the fact that Esau was saved according to Genesis 33?

Esau is not a reprobate like Calvinists interpret Roman 9!

That should be a red flag if there ever was one.

There goes unconditional election in Romans 9!

Calling people like John Piper a brother isn't helping him or anyone else, except the devil. He needs someone to let him know he's lost and on his way to Hell and leading others with him. Calling him a good pastor is very disturbing and seems to contradict everything you have said about Calvinism.

Thank you both. Loved every minute. Wondering this-- is there any connection to the "elect" discussion and the belief of some that God is going to use Israel, Jerusalem, and all the jewish people as the station for the world before during or after the millenium? In other words "chosen people =chosen nation= Israel" ??? Calvanism effects more things then just salvation.

Anytime you talk about evil, you need to explain what kind of evil you are talking about.

Reformed theology is the most man exalting, man worshiping group i have ever encountered. Also when in scripture dose God make these eternal decrees?

Calvinism is a false doctrine which makes these guys false teachers they need the whole doctrine of Christ or they have none of it. They have alot in common with folks like the JWs in the fact that by their calculations only calvinists are going to make it whether we believe in calvanism or not. Meaning if your not a calvinist you are whether you choose to be or not. They are in some ways the devil's they have been warning people about for years.

Thank you both for your work fighting for the truth of God's true love for ALL people . Calvanism has held some people especially those who already have experienced rejection from childhood etc. from coming to the Lord. This wrong theology of Calvanism is poison.

I’m sure it’s just a coincidence that those Calvinistic people I have encountered, forcefully assert and belittle to make their point. (Forgive me for the sarcasm, as Paul would say, I’m speaking like a madman.) collections of scripture to make points got us the prosperity gospel, because a collection twists the Word. Look at the whole Word for yourself!

Jesus told us we would know people by the fruit of their lives. Beware of those who have knowledge, which in itself, isn’t a fruit. Those who know Jesus will strive to be gentle and lowly, like He reminds us is His heart.

Many Charismatic /Word of Faith teachers say that you need to give God permission to act on your behalf, or to move...

What’s a 7 point Calvinist? What are the other 2 points?

It cracks me up that people refer to Piper as humble. Based on what? The way that he modulates his voice? His grandiose gesticulations, flailing his arms about like a demented child? Oh, you mean the way he sent out a “never-Trump” piece to his followers just 2 weeks prior to the election yet maintains he’s loathe to undermine his calling by getting into politics?

So Piper used his misinterpretation of Romans nine to misinterpret the rest of the bible? Can you say 'confirmation bias' boys and girls?

Piper????? I give him permission???? Borders on blasphemy. Watch it Piper!!!!!

He wanted to feel special because he was bullied as a child.

such an interesting conversation!

I am so grateful for the ministry of Flowers. He has been thinking about the soteriological topics of Calvinism, and bringing many clear thinking, highly qualified guests for so long that he is able to bring piercing clarity to why Calvinism is wrong. A much needed antidote to this disease within Christendon, especially since it's roots, at least in the West, go back to the 4th century with Augustine and contain the illustrious founders of the Reformation which we, without being informed otherwise, would implicitly trust.

No doubt about it, Leighton Flowers, because he has thought and talked about this topic so extensively, has become a clear thinking force Calvinists must reckoned with.

As you go through these points it not only destroys Calvinism but it gives me a deeper understanding of the gospel itself. Thank you. Praise. the Lord!

When I was a new Christian many years ago I I met a couple of Calvinist. I rejected it because the "thumb print" of God in my spirit let me know that Calvinism was wrong.

John Piper is so deceived he has become an eloquent deceiver. He is difficult to listen to.

Piper boldly teaches a doctrine of demons, a false gospel.

What is your personal assessment of calvinism? Is it false doctrine or not?

Warren McGrew has been "grewing" on me. I appreciate his sincere desire to pursue truth with the desire to stay as positive as possible. Laughter is good medicine and we can learn a lot from Warren.

I heard Piper do a Q&A where he claimed all things were and are predetermined by God, even the lady in the front row with her legs crossed a certain way. He then went on to tell people that THEY needed to DO certain things. That THEY weren't seeking God enough. The THEY weren't holy enough and so on. I just couldn't believe the disconnect there. John, if all things are predetermined, then THEY are doing exactly what God predetermined them to do, and you are mucking it up!

Dr. Flowers, I love how you keep the meticulous determinants' feet to the fire with your phrase "Because thatis what God has decreed they would do." But more than that, even, I love the Chessboard Analogy.