Rise and Fall of the 308 Winchester

I’ve done a lot of depredation work using both the 308 and the 6.5 Creedmoor and I can assure you inside of normal ranges 0 to 400 yards or so the Creedmoor will never be a 308 on game animals ….never. You can look at all the ballistic charts you want, but the larger mass and width of the 308 bullet just does more damage, hits harder and provides a lot bigger and better bleed hole should you botch the shot a little. I love a Creedmoor on the bench but I’ll stick with my 308s in the field👍

I like 3006 better

Sorry my friend....it depends on the man behind the the gun....!!!!!!

The .308 has NOT fallen. I kill deer and antelope every year with them.

Because of an injury shooting , hunting with my 3006 days ended. I bought the AR10 308, thanks to buffer spring i can target and hunt. With ar10 im out to easy 500yards. I looked for 3006 AR holy crap the justification not there with price.

So why does the military want a short action? Is there a reason for this?

I just bought a new rifle and it’s a 308. I could’ve bought any rifle I wanted and I chose that caliber. I do have a 65 Creedmoor a 270 and a 30 Ott six. I had to have it. I Hunt I don’t do too much range type shooting or even care if it’s within 300 yards I won’t hesitate.

I'll be using a 308 this deer season... Deer Beware!

Im from South Africa and the 308 is my favorite cartridge, enough for everything but dangerous game.
But I rather download my 30-06 to 308 speed, then I get very low pressure and my cases last forever.
With 308 and full resizing I get casehead separation after a few reloads.

I’d still call the .308 the best middle weight cartridge around .
I know the 6.5 is a better long range cartridge but I still chose .308 for my last 2 AR-10 purchases.
For long range work I went with a legit heavy hitter .338 Lapua
Like they say, “Go big or go home “ 😂

I really like the 308 cartridge because it is pretty damn good at medium ranges, it works great in AR and AK platforms plus it's cheaper and more popular than most other rounds. 6.5 is a better round for distance but the barrel life on 6.5 rifles is much shorter, it's more expensive, it doesn't cycle as well in an AR platform and it isn't as common as 308. As far as bear 308 is great for defense and I imagine it would do just fine for hunting as well.

The.308 is a great cartridge and it does exactly what it needs to do and plenty of people use it to great effect all the time! Enjoy!

Looking back, when the ammo shelves were bare, .308 seemed to be in stock. But then again, so was 6.5 Creedmore. I just couldnt find .243, 30-30, 7-08 or any of the fodder I needed to hunt with.

How about the twist rates for the 30 caliber’s that’s got to make the difference’s in accuracy!

I don't think I heard anything about the .307 Winchester.

A hot load in 308 cartridge with 150 grain FMJ bullet is faster than 30-06 M1 Garand load with same grain bullet.

Hi Ron, maybe a different approach for introducing calibers might be helpful, to alot of us (30 caliber) fans we stick with we enjoy doing most, shooting! we all have in common! Now with that said we are creatures of interest too, i would personally be interested in you do a video comparing your results such as 308 vs 6.5 at different ranges (with cross wind factors)... But with new off the shelf products that you are not being sponsored by ammo and rifle! Basically comparing budget ($500-) calibers and ammo that is available to help us decide on are next purchase. Thanks Nate

I love the 308 round ❤

This caliber gave me my only scope bite!!! Lol😂

7mm-08>308. That said 307 does have more bullets options. But 7mm-08 is definitely even more versatile

I have and have had just about every caliber out there . I'm not a great shot but my 308 makes me look like one.

The history of the cartridge is very interesting.

I recycle the brass for a 4,000 member gun club up here in Canada and I have to say that out of an 800lb collection there is FAR more 308 and 30-06 than anything other than 223/556 and 9mm. 6.5 is there but MUCH less of it. I can ALWAYS count on there being a LOT of 308 and 06. With a good bullet and a powder your rifle likes, they are VERY capable cals.

The rise and fall of the 308 Winchester?
Sir, we've certainly seen the rise of this cartridge, but we haven't nor will we probably ever see the fall of the 308 win.
You are correct in that it's not as fast or as powerful as the 30-06, but the difference between the two cartridges is less than 100 fps (typically 50-75 fps) in velocity across the entire spectrum of available bullets, including 220 grain loads. This makes so very little real world difference in any category that it's literally not worth debating about.
Additionally, 308 achieves those velocities with an average of 11 grains less gunpowder, so in most cases you're using around 24% more powder in the 30-06 to achieve only around 2-3% velocity increases. This means that 308 is far more efficient than 30-06.
Pretty much everyone who knows anything knows that short action cartridges have an edge over long action cartridges in terms of accuracy and this is no different in the 308 vs 30-06 comparison. And regardless of what you say, 308 is an inherently accurate cartridge just like 6.5 Creedmoor is. This has been proven time and again by shooters and handloaders everywhere in the world.
Lastly, 308 has proven itself as an outstandingly versatile hunting cartridge all over the world. It is capable of taking any game animal that the 30-06 can take, it has a larger selection of factory ammunition available for it, and it produces less recoil than 30-06.
I have seen plenty of your videos and I know you're one of these die hard 30-06 guys, but (just as I have done with the others like you) I challenge you to prove to me how 30-06 is in any way TRULY better than the 308.
Let's just summarize here, you can't. And yet you sensationalize the 30-06 while speaking about the 308 as if it's just an inadequate wannabe. That's why I just can't take people like you seriously because you're either so prideful and biased that you simply can't admit to how things really are or you don't have an honest clue what you're talking about. 🎤

The fact that a cartridge is superior to one that was made 70 years ago is not a surprise. The fact that the 308 is not quite up to the maximum performance of the 30 ought 6 is not a surprise. My understanding is that the reason the military did not use the 300 Savage was too fold they wanted a longer neck and they felt that the rim of the Savage was not strong enough for fully automatic weapons. The army staff knew it did not match the '06 enough to the original loads. The improvements of the 30 ought 6 with modern powders shouldn't even be taken into account
I have long thought they missed the boat by not going to something like 110 grain boattail 250 Ackley improved but I am weird.
At least then they would have a good case to start from when they wanted to do the sub caliber high-velocity program. As I recall the 5.56 was about 200 feet per second slower than the program originally called for and it was only made for the short inefficient bullets. A 22 250 Ackley improved 70 grain bullet in a chrome-lined barrel might have been interesting.

Having the powder closer to the primer on ignition creates more consistency which is what makes the .308 more accurate than the 3006. A deer won't know which one it was shot by.

Yep, the 308 is useless. Y’all pack up all your 308 guns & ammo & send them to me, better yet I’ll come get it. Just say when & where.

What about a 300 Weatherby Mag? I am pushing a 168 Sierra Match King @ 3567 feet per second.

Chris Kyle said in an interview , that his favorite all time sniper round was the .308 Winchester.

Real hunters like the .30 cal diameter for large wound channels and usually 2 holes for bleed out, Short action for handier rifles, less recoil than a 30-06 due to smaller powder charge. Effective and great ballistics at all real range shooting ranges of under 300 yards.

better inherant accuracy v 30.06... yes a more square case gives a better more consistent powder burn for the same barrel length. This is the reson Target rifles have barrels of 26 to 32 in. Now a cartrigde like 6mmBR, made for bench rest, is even more square for better burn. The proof in the pudding is you are getting 90% the balistic performance of a 30-06 with a third less recoil. the extra recoil of the 30.06 is gas burning after the bullet is long gone. Also yes 6.5 CR is better for Range. It's a target cartirdge that fits in the 308 form factor.

What a great story teller, love listening.

I neck my .50 bmg brass down to 6.5m and use a 475 grain 6.5 bullet to obtain MV of 4315 FPS and SD of 2.5

But at least they're in stock and always will be. The oldest military round and most readily available.

So the .308 is not good enough to kill a dear. But it good enough for USMC to kill the enemy and invade foreign countries. 🤣🤣

“I think it’s because…..”

You keep on.

Why not the Savage? What are the odds someone at Winchester made a little campaign donation to someone on the armed services committee haha

This is how i see it.
People who live out west love 6.5
People who live east love 308.
Why would i buy 6.5 if i barely shoot beyond 150?

308 kills better beyond 400 when bullet weight matters when they slow down.
Windage and elevation corrections

It doesn’t really matter what anyone thinks about 30 calibers anyway. I currently hunt with a 6.5 PRC and absolutely love it. I’ve killed more deer with a 30’06 than any other caliber. Facts are that the 30 caliber has dirt napped more critters on the planet than any other caliber and it’ll be that way after we’re all dead and gone. 30 30, 308 and 30’06 are the hunting studs of the world. Personally if I had to pick one caliber and could only have one for everything even though I’ve never hunted with it, it would be the 7mm mag or 7 PRC, just makes too much sense to me.

I know of about two dozen shooters, just in my local area who love and use the .308 very much! And it has done the job on deer, elk, bear, etc. for decades!!!

Beh, the .308 is a flash in the pan. Give me .30-06 any day. :)

308 and 306 are matched for power and distance, provin fact. Ballistic jel and stopping power

.308 is going to stick around for another hundred years for the same reason .30-30 has been around since 1895. It's established and it's good enough. It's not the best at anything but it's good enough at almost everything.

You know. A lot of special force guys still grab that SOCOM M-14.
The gun rack is loaded, they pick what they want. They go for the .308.
A great all around round. "The" best, no. There is no "best".
You'll find niches for everytime. But for an all around cartridge, it's great.
.270 is great. 06 is great. Hell the 8mm mauser is great, i still deer hunt with it. Sporterized Kar98, great woods gun, deer doesnt run or doesnt get up.
And if the 6.5 was so great, why did the militarily NOT adopt it?
Won't punch body armour. Simple.
150gr .308 will cover the vast majority of hunting situations.

Man, .308 is the neckbeard of rifle cartridges.

If it's so bad why don't they make AR's chambered in 30.06 or .270 ?????

As a re-loader .308 "bullet" is my favorite , fit my 308 Win , 30-06 & 30-30 rifles ! 😉

The fall of the .308🤔 that must be why the .308 round has the most projectile selections available, most of which are under200 grains.

My understanding was that army had 2 30 06 rounds. O