PHEV: The truth about buying a plug-in hybrid EV. Is it worth the $$$? | Auto Expert John Cadogan

why I purchased a 2011 Volvo T6 85kms ... makes greenies cry 400hp AWD 3.0 turbo .... I purchased for 12% of the new price of a new PHEV one.... and this beast uses av 11.5lts 100kms fuel .. would use less if I didn't fit 20 wheels with 255/55 tyres ..now in 5yrs the Volvo will have say 150kms on the clock and I'll prob still get 8-9k so I lost 5-6k on purchase price ...now you buy 70k+ PHEV in 5yrs with 50kms its lost min $30k and its gutless and you will still cost $$$ to run prob around 5-8lts per 100kms

My use-case fits the description of a good reason to buy a PHEV - plus I have solar in my home and tend to keep my vehicles for 10 years or more - but the price of PHEV's is ridiculous. For over $20k less than the Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV I got a Chevy Bolt EV and a Ford Maverick Hybrid. I get TWO vehicles, one is FULL EV, and the other can be driven long distances and TOW (well, it can tow 2k lbs).

Calling batteries "Big Dirty Batteries" does come off as biased though. I do mostly agree with the fundamentals here, but that line of thinking needs to be taken with a grain of salt. Mining and producing batteries has environmental costs, and by extension EV's come with higher environmental costs out of the gate compared to an ICE car. Some estimates show that the cost of producing the battery that goes into the Tesla Model Y is around the same amount of environmental cost in gasoline to drive 13,500 miles in a similar ICE vehicle. It's not zero, but it's pretty good given the numbers... Also, batteries are heavy, but the size of batteries in PHEV and hybrid vehicles are significantly smaller. The average size of BEV batteries is 83kWh, the average size of a PHEV is 15kWh, and the average size of a hybrid 1.5kWh. That's less than 20% of the weight of BEV's battery compared to a PHEV's battery and if we are to take the difference between BEV's and PHEV's and apply it to the number of miles it takes the environmental cost to produce the battery in the model Y, a PHEV is around 2,400 miles.

My current gripes and hesitation with the transition to EV's is that 1) battery technology is advancing fast, which means that current vehicles will depreciate horribly, but also that many of the criticisms of EV's won't be true in 5-10 years. 2) The big auto manufacturers are not taking the constraints of current technology into account in their strategy or marketing, they are just taking their current line of ICE vehicles and converting them to EV's. This is stupid given the fit between the types of ICE vehicles that are popular today (big, heavy, inefficient), and what would make the most sense for EV vehicles given constraints of current technology, the environmental cost and limited supply of current battery chemistries, and the current charging infrastructure and electric grid. 3) BMW's strategy on the i3 extended range with a full electric drive train and a gas generator that charged the battery as-needed was kind of genius for a PHEV. Maybe it was a little ahead of its time and maybe the implementation needs to be worked out better, but it allowed for a smaller battery and a smaller, significantly less complex gas motor, reducing the total weight. I don't know of anybody doing this.

Trying to sell a torch - logged off

I went through all this a few years ago, EV, hybrid, plug in, IC. I found the cheapest is to buy an old IC car you can fix yourself. Then the worst costs are licenses, taxes and insurance. So that's what I have done and will do for the rest of my life. My bride wanted a new car, so I went through the arguments with her, and we got a new IC car. The EV fuel costs would break even in like 20 years in fuel costs alone. Now there's extra EV taxes in our state on top of it. I am looking for a cheap solar array and a cheap self-fixable EV to use as a power backup. That I will do, because I don't need to drive much anymore, now. I will only come around when the sun shines, and the battery's charged. I am retired.

Your last point regarding national energy security is the main reason I bought my Outlander PHEV. My second reason is the option to use gas or electric provides resiliency against spike in gas prices or blackout from the grid due to occasional heat wave here in Southern California. I average 1500 miles between fill ups (meaning I can run on EV mode a lot) so a PHEV definitely works for my use case.

John ya bastard. I purchased an outlander PHEV because of your review on the Outlander 2023 model. I’ve got a novated lease through work. The Australian Gov concession with no FBT or GST was too good to pass up. Plus I needed to reduce my taxable income. If you talk shit on this car I won’t be happy mate😂

As you stated at the beginning, whether or not buying a PHEV is worth the $$$ depends on a number of factors. If it's time for me to move on from my 15 year old ICE car which I bought new and I'm in the market to buy a new car to replace it, should I buy another ICE car, a hybrid, a PHEV, a BEV, or a fuel cell car that would meet my transport needs? I have roof top solar at my home, most of my trips are local, and I make occasional long road trips beyond the range of BEVs available in the market. The Prius Prime and the Kia Niro PHEV are similar in size to the 2008 Toyota Matrix (around $20K in 2008) that I plan to replace but they cost at least $10K more. I would love to get a PHEV version of the BYD Dolphin (the standard range BEV version in China is around $16K and it can power your home or essential appliances via its battery during a power outage) but that's not available in the US. I can get a standard hybrid Prius Prime or Niro for a few $K less but I wouldn't be able to take advantage of the electricity generated by my PV system. No consumer car is an investment meant to generate financial returns. The appeal of alternative energy cars is to reduce or eliminate carbon emissions and pollution at the point of use. The possibility that they can provide financial savings over time is just a bonus - especially if they can last 10 to 15 years for me.

So I'm sitting here in the EU waiting for my PHEV(used). I didn't buy it because of the fuel economy(nothing tops my old Citroen C3 1.5 diesel from 2019 easily attainable 26+ km/l with some urban mixed in and 30+ if its just a long stretch of highway). I bought it because it was the same price as the same car without hybrid tech, while also having more horsepower and more trim and it was dirt cheap compared to other similar cars. I wanted a more sporty car and a way nicer interior. It's gonna cost me more in fuel but if I'm smart about it I can negate some of that. Charging where I live isn't cheap which is ironic because our government has been all about windmills and how good they are for the enviroment and eletricity price, f'ing joke. I have any sort of driving style mapped out in an excell sheet and unless i'm doing short 1-5 kilometer trips through town, I might as well not charge the battery cause the price for charging makes it almost as expensive as just running on gas.

I really like my 2023 ford maverick hybrid XL. Costed less than a new honda civic, and I'm averaging 45mpg. Over the 8k miles I've driven so far. If environmentalists are serious about reducing our fuel use, then lower priced hybrids are the fastest way.

So which car would you buy dude? EV PHEV Or Hybrid?

Wow what a great review, I'm currently considering buying an outlander phev and I was considering almost everything you spoke about. For me it come down to the fact that my daily commute is short about 16 km / per day total, electricity is relatively cheap, I will plug the vehicule everyday and the possibility to use it has a generator for emergency are important. The other thing I did consider so far is the reliability of the vehicule and the government incentive at the moment bring it back to the cost of the hybrid version. My old car is getting to the end of what I can continue to repair (a 2010 mazda getting rusty) to me I calculated around 7 years to earn anything about fuel economy since I dont do a lot of km per years, but having the car has a backup generator for the cold winter im case of emergency make me quite happy for it. Also it will fit my familly a bit more with the cargo space.
Anyway great video !

You may as well just get an EV for the price of a PHEV.

When You buy PHEV you are not overpaying for the battery version to gas and then you have to drive 70k to break even. You are making investment do you know how much would cost you to get 20 kw battery for off-grid? Much much more than difference between norma outlander price and phev one

If you want PHEV to make more sense, you shrink the ICE from 100+HP to 20HP/15kW (just enough to sustain normal highway driving) to minimize the amount of "dead weight" getting carried around and bump the electric drive train to 150-200kW so the generator only kicks on when the battery is low or in winter when you need the extra heat to get everything up to optimal temperature 10X quicker.

One thing that you haven't noted is the cost savings with no FBT on novated lease with PHEV and electric vehicles.

What about after when you put in the FBT exemption.

Concidering Australia is not oil self sufficient and what we do produce is refined overseas, then maybe it is a good bet 👍

Hi John I work as a ride-share driver & drive about 55,000km a year. I was thinking a plug-in would make sense but not sure. I currently drive a Prius & I’m very happy with it but need to buy a new car now. Do you think a plug-in is a good idea or not. I’m not ready for a fully electric car yet.

Good review but are we missing out on the FBT exempt benefits by the govt. That gets you a good amount back in payg saving over a period of time. Plus if one has access to charging it helps.