Analysis: The Effects of Salt

I'd argue that the third element of fairness isn't actually fair. What's "fair" inside it is covered as extension of the 2nd fairness.

It can be argued that doing the second stunning/grappling move when the enemy is stunned is much much easier than doing it the first time when the enemy is still walking freely. Hence its reward should not be the same, because it doesn't "deserve" it.

Same with moves that is rythmical. Doing it the 19th time is much much easier than 2nd time because you can just follow a rythm so it also shouldn't get the same reward. It's different if it's like Daigo parry where, if anything, the 9th parry is even harder than the first one. There, you deserve to get ever increasing reward.

Same with beating an already beaten enemy, if a game like rts implements decreasing resource as you're losing. So, all of these "snowballing" phenomenon is deemed unfair because the first good move against the enemy is rewarded with... winning the entire thing, which is of course deemed unfair because if it's actually designed like that, why let the game continue at all after the first battle? It's like health bar, it's expected that for every portion of the bar, depleting it requires equal effort otherwise the health bar is useless.

So yeah, social justice isn't fair. We don't need pity mechanism for competitive games, just balance deserving reward for efforts.

My controls weren't working

and if they weren't, you were playing dishonorably
and if you weren't, you were playing without skill
and if you were, it's not fun to play that way
and if it is, you only care about winnning

feel free to copy and paste in the battle hub.

I teach my ten-year-old daughter that she can't get angry when playing fighting games. But when she's not looking, I call the Ken who rushed me down and destroyed me in SF6 "braindead."

The "that move is broken" in that deadpan, straightforward tone is so real LMFAO. I love my fighting games and competition but even I have been there.
By the way, I have to draw attention to the Sigma Fortress 1 theme at 5 mins into the video. Beautiful, most beautiful song choice. One of my favorites in gaming.

It honestly feels kind of weird comparing social justice to infamous comback mechanics. Like, I understand the connection, but that's absolutely a false equivalence.

It’s important to recognize when, like you said, complaints are legitimate. Many games have nearly been ruined for me because nobody bothered to at least tell me WHY what I found ridiculous was more balanced than what I thought. “Get good” isn’t something I can measure. It’s not a meter I can fill or a piece of trivia I can learn, so using it as a catch-all whenever somebody dares point out what they perceive as a flaw is just showing that you either don’t have an argument or don’t care enough about other players to take their experience seriously.

This is crazy to rewatch this now that cheatbox is accepted and modern controls are going to be in every single fighting game until either tournaments ban it or the industry collapses and is reset by nerds again.

Could we get a video essay going into modern vs classic in sf6 please?

My friend got salty when we played MK11 because I blocked his attacks too much and won because of it.

This answered pretty much nothing 😂

Just because something can be countered, doesn't mean that the majority of players who do not look up guides or videos will actually do so, driving away the playerbase. We can pretend competetive is the core of the game, but if nobody buys it, they're gonna stop making the games to begin with.

There's plenty of shit in fighting games that's straight up not fun to deal with. The biggest problem is that we can't choose who to play with, matchmaking does that for you. In real life, if you're playing like an asshole, you get kicked out of the game. And you can smugly tell yourself whatever you want, but nobody will play with you again or recognize your ''skill''

And believing that game developers always know better is absolute horseshit. MK12 beta had a fucking Kitana infinite. They've been making Mortal Kombat for like 30 years. They don't always know best, which is why games are continously patched for years to try and achieve balance and fun.

I've found Brawlhalla to be an interesting example of the opposite, the devs play into salt and toxicity to try and reduce the coherency of outcry for changes to the game's balance while advertising the game, not too disimilar from the regulators of irl competitive driving, where bias is intentionally introduced to increase discussion online

NGL, that sailor moon game looks kinda dope XD

Facts

Just wanna point out that angelsoft devs went on to work at arcsys.

Arcsys, please make sailor moon s 2. With just as much salt.

Imagine not being able to punish a god fist because it's bad form.

40+ years old and still tbaggin these emo youngsters

Retrospectively in essence this is probably why fighting games will literally never become mainstream because both parties think they're right

I'm pretty much an outsider with fighting games [I got big into Smash 4 in high school and attended a tournament hosted by our robotics club where I had a lot of fun even though I just barely lost in the first round, and my only other experience with "real" fighting games are week-long stints with Tekken 3, BlazBlue Cross Tag Battle, and the Saturn ports of Virtua Fighter and Dead or Alive] but it's really interesting to me that there seems to be a fine line where losing stops being an interesting learning experience where you get to watch the other guy's ultimate and his character's flashy victory animation, and it instead becomes a frustrating slap to the face. Like Dead or Alive- I was getting into it recently but just kept fucking losing to Gen Fu in the arcade mode, over and over and over. I eventually figured out I needed to use the hold button to grab his endless flurry of attacks and use them against him, but the timing is so tight and his nature as a CPU player instead of a real person meant he didn't have any tells, so I essentially just had to guess my way to hold-spamming victory. The win didn't feel good, no longer having to fight Gen Fu is what felt good.
Very interesting psychology behind this genre.

blows my mind that the korean tekken community had the honorable rules to not use too many lows or ducking under high hits. that's just bonkers to me. maybe because it was so integral to my own game plan.. lol.. but still, that's literally the game.. hit where they are not, and avoid what you can. i always thought Mishimas were pretty weak since their signature moves where short ranged high hits that you could punish the hell out of with pretty great ease. maybe that was arcade specific, and not for pro tourny play, i find that interesting to think about now.

🤣🤣my favorite quote. ”what’s wrong with you? You trippin bruh. You trippin!”

i guess for sailor moon, it’s so equally unbalanced, they don’t have the urge to be mad about it 😭

Need to remember back in the arcade days... games had only one purpose.
To eat quarters.

I still don't get it, there is never going to be a new revolutionary game anymore. I have been blessed to see street fighter 2, mortal Kombat, Killer instinct, tekken 2, Xmen children of the atom, king of fighters, Art of war and all the great games at the arcade. The reason they were great was because they weren't easy! You got your arse handed to you and you paid for it. Now games literally hold your hand and even give you health (Call of duty), turn off friendly fire and get patched to gimped. Nintendo even added a pass it for me option in a super Mario Brothers game for the wii.... Whats so fun now? I still play tekken 7 and killer Instinct 3, but its not the same

Hmmm... Play a fighting game or Deepthroat a cactus.

I dunno about you mofos but that cactus is looking preeeeetty busin’.

Honestly thought this was about salting your controller for a advantage over your opponent

As a Sagat Player, I still to this very day I am not ok to be hit like I was stabding, if my character is not actually standing: Sagat is tall guy so there is no excuse for this.
One can call it as he wants, but it will always be a broken mechanic that should not happen.
Now if you excuse me, amma get a salt bath 😁

Less of a memolord attitude would be better.
If you put unequal opponents in a game where there is certain tricks and metas, it is easy to see why they get frustrated.
Nobody wants to loose solely because they do not know certain abuses of ingame mechanics.

that was a beautiful finish , i had no idea majestic fighting game even existed , and it's full of our childhood waifus XD .....

I dont play at all, because my rage gets out of control. i should get some anger management done.

For me, I found I had demonic cruel salt when fighting Ganondorf with Falcon in melee. You can't have emotions, or soul, or else you get hurt and that controller will be destroyed.

Lets be VERY clear about 1 thing….

Sweaty little boys mash the same combo over and over in the corner.

Real men back up into the center of the stage and say “is that all you got?! Ha”

It takes 1000x more skill to BACK AWAY from your opponent when you have them in the corner, and still win the fight.

“Positional Advantage” has nothing to do with being a Corner-B!+€h who spams.

You theres no skill in your timing when your opponent isn’t fighting back.

Early tekken games were ARESOME because they had no arena boundaries.

The background image would just slide and spin where the camera needed to go, and fighters could only be so far apart…. Arena had no boundaries and it was BEAUTIFUL.

noy my problem

A lot of players actually use "The Scrublord's Prayer" in Dead by Daylight.

I have 140 hours in sg2e, and I’m pretty good with beowulf. And it was and is a long and hard road to get here and keep going and improving. It’s worth it to me because of the satisfaction I get when I sweep a team as solo wulf and know that I did that, there was no mechanic helping me win arbitrarily, I did it of my own skill. My advice to anyone learning fighting games is get good, but I mean that in a good way. Sometimes the only way to do well is to simply practice and improve your skill, or get good. It takes effort but when you realize you have over a hundred hours and you can consistently take down teams you can feel satisfaction that all that came from you and only you. It’s an awesome feeling in skull girls being able to block a mixup filia into Annie, especially since I got there on my own. What I’m trying to say is just practice and stick with it, and you can achieve greatness. Also it’s better to strive for consistency than always winning or crazy plays or comebacks.

This started off well, but you swerve into non-relevant analysis of the meaning of 'fairness', without demonstrating that our monkey brains are connected to this poorly-defined-linguistic-construct in the moment of 'salt'.

I remember back in 2013 my girlfriend saw that picture of Alex and Elena when we were playing 3rd Strike and was busting up laughing, "like really?" 😂

I like the salt-the-earth era a lot better but maybe thats just me? If he dies he dies 😂

I found that most salty comments start with "LOL" before going on the typical rant.

To be fair, if you beat someone with a low kick in a fighting game, that's not a real victory.

Wait, why was punishing a whiffed Godfist bad manners in Tekken?

I guess I just don't understand, if I was good enough to evade it and punish, why would that be an issue?

If you need to use any exploit in a FG to win then your fucking trash. End of story.