A TOTAL FLOP in the making? | Classified Powershift HUB | REAMING

Thanks Hambini...very enlightening. Would love to see a video on Pinion gearbox effciency.

Peak Torque gave what appears to be a realistic review of the hub. The efficiency claims appear to be close to Classified's. Please note I use "appear/s".

Can someone enlighten me why this hub got so much hype??? Is this just the marketing??? The "internal gear hub" or "IGH" has been there for decades, I myself even have the SRAM DD3 IGH, which is now discontinued, setup as 3x10, with Shimano Ultegra derailleur and Tiagra STI levers (highest "tier" that provides 3x), on my 20'' "road bike", so to get the same gear inch (except for the crazy downhill speed top end) of an ordinary 700c 2x bike. These are cable-pulled IGH and is compatible with anything that has the same 1:1 pull ratio. After setup, they look the same, ride the same, as any road bike. I didn't feel them as "superior" or "inferior" than front mech. So I just... didn't get it why people acting like this is something that is ground-breaking... As of the efficiency, I didn't experience any of that difference myself. My two bike (the other one is a carbon road bike with deep wheels) feels exactly the same under 35kph, though after 40k/hr the 20'' folding bike start to feel exponentially aero-dragged, but still I don't believe it has anything to do with the hub. However I even tend to "think" that IGH could be a little bit more efficient because at least with this 3x system, I rarely use the biggest ring and the smallest ring. The 97% efficiency of traditional system is under the assumption that there's little to no cross chainring. When the cross chainring happens, even with the simple "resolve of force" model in high school you can get that efficiency is greatly dropped as a lot of force goes lateral without actually do any mechanic work. In reality, cross chainring happens a lot and is unavoidable. If you count this, then the IGH may have some advantages, but I don't think that's something you can easily feel. The wind direction the clothes how clean your bike is all contributes a lot more to this, which makes the front-mech/IGH irrelevant in the equation. There's nothing wrong in IGH however except for this one's price. I don't believe this thing worth anywhere near that $2000 price tag. The SRAM DD3 sales at just less than $200, and remember it has even one more gear... If SRAM like it, they can definitely remove that additional gear, do some material tweaking and bring all that weight down to a similar level, without too much if any additional cost. If this thing sells at $200 then yeah why not, however, this stuff acting like the were the one doing some original work and charge at this price... For anyone actually buy it I believe it's just IQ tax well paid.

As a pro wheel builder I immediately had an issue with the fact that they limit you to straight pull spokes only. This was a huge mistake. Any straight pull wheel will be excessively stiff for things like gravel riding/racing. A greater likelihood of spoke breakage and an uncomfortable ride to put it simply. Straight pull wheels lack the necessary compliance for a good ride quality. Obviously no wheel builder was ever consulted when designing this hub. This begs the question, what else did they miss?

I only have IGH roadster/ tour bikes now. I miss NOTHING about defaileurs. Even my Rohloff14 is direct drive at 18 to 20 mph.
What maybe this hub got wrong is having the high as the direct drive. Where you really need efficiency is on UP HILLS. The SA 8w does this. When I go flat or downhill with my SA 5w, I really don't feel a drag. I've done 45/ 46 mph. Direct is in the middle and is the most used, where it beats defaileurs all day long.
I can see it is a positive to get rid of the granny ring. Far easier to keep clean.
OTOH, 1x with 11 speed and pie plate cogs is a total FARCE IMO. I've seen $20,000 MTB with this. LOL hahahahahah

I think this is ridiculous. There is no way this is better than a front derailleur. I use to have a "two speed" bike when I was eight years old (early 70's). It shifted between gears by pedaling slightly backward. Obviously it was not very good for sprinting or pedaling uphill. It was quite unique. None of my friends had anything like it.

It was all bells and whistles on on other bicycle channels. Thank you for honesty

I could see a usecase in certain scenarios. Let's say you are a sprinter (incidentially like Kittel or Greipel who apparentely endorse it): You benefit from the aero gains when it matters, and you pay for it while climbing in the small gear when they are not competing for anything anyway other than getting up the hill in the allotted time.
Another usecase would be if you want for some strange reason a massive chainring (say a 60 tooth) and still a small gear to get up the one hill on the stage. A 60-42 chainring combo wouldn't be feasible, but the Classified would give you that. Campenaerts has been seen with such a setup.

Rob Britton won BWR on this hub. Madman!

Really love this video. Can you do another one with more detail? you mention it very briefly, but can you do a more in-depth analysis and comparison with the drop of efficiency with cross chaining? Also if you only have 1x in front, don't you get worse cross chaining since nobody would mix the small chainring with the smallest sprocket? meaning classified would actually have more cross chaining than a standard front derailleur.

You think, you think, you think a lot, but know nothing. I have been driving this for a year, and know from experience that this system has never faltered or had other problems. Installation was done without any problem. So make sure your information is correct.

No comment 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

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It is difficult to see how this product can enhance competitive cycling.

If “marginal gains” are a thing, then so also are “marginal losses”.
The ratio is a fixed function, whereas chainrings are readily swappable.
The thru axle release lever has to remain in position, adding wind resistance.
The expense of having a hub with every wheel set you own, is prohibitive, even for a pro team.
Weight is redistributed rearwards, causing linear imbalance.
Instant shifting under load isn’t really needed in this part of gear changing sequence.

Multiple chainrings are something we would all like to eliminate, but that seems to be the only true benefit here.
The uptake and normalisation of this product will depend upon the marketing men being even more skilled than the brilliant engineers.

Don't start with a scream..... ...

Overly complex, expensive and prone to failures in order to get the same F thing accomplished than by existing simple, inexpensive and performant components.
Perfect for the bicycle industry.

I dont see a point of this hub at all.. except something new to sell and replace when its broken.

Back in 1975 or 1875 or 1775 I was in high school and had my own bike shop. Sturmey Archer was everywhere, and I allowed (assigned) my brother to do all the internal gear hubs which was fine by both of us. The hub had a little plastic flip cap so an end user could squirt in some oil with a trigger driven hand held pump.

Most people think that if a little oil is good then more is better, and others deicded to leave such things to "the pros" whom they never made it to see and they used leaded air (unleaded gasoline was a new thing) as a lubricant, so nothing could go wrong. Some were so maladjusted that the shift lever had ne effect.

When gears are out of sight they are out of mind and we can guess how many people are either out of their mind or their mind is out of them. I think the sun and planet gear system is so old that it was developed by Copernicus (the dog in Back to the Future) because it takes a son of a female dog to build and sell such a thing. If they are well funded then maybe this is a front for something nefarious. Nice review, and I also believe the gear to be pinned.

Fuck. My ears. You got me. Again.

At least the cheapest shimano front derailleur is working fine

It is just too expensive, which means it will not sell well, which means it will cease to exist.

One thing you missed on the "pros" list is the ability to shift gears under full load and instantly. That being said I agree with your analysis on all fronts.

The price is too high. The hub would be useful for older riders who also want to conquer very steep climbs. With a front derailleur and a 34/34 mountain ratio, the ratio would be similar to an 11-50 cassette with at least 16 gears.

What about the cost of drop chain... consistent with Sram

I think a similar combination of hub gear and cassette was tried before. I think it was Sachs, but it was also the late 80's so any detail escapes me now.

As I understand it, the one significant minus to Sturmey Archer and similar hub gears is the efficiency loss. These guys seem to have reinvented it. Pity, really.

Wow. £900 for a two speed Sturmey Archer with complicated electronics and SRAM Red priced caseette. As the Dragons Den team would say “I’m out”

I find this interesting. Compare a classified hub with a standard cassette to any eight speed internal geared rear hub and then we are talking apples to apples. Comparing an external two-speed front derailleur system to an internal two-speed system is comparing apples to bananas.
As to the claimed losses, the average 'Joe' loses more in their chain in most cases as many ride with woefully filthy chains, cogs, and rings.

I think you should consider getting building an rig to measure efficiency. Also to get data for crosschaining.
I suppose you could attach an electric motor to the chainring

It is hard to beat the light weight and high efficiency of a derailleur drivetrain. I think the downsides of a front derailleur are overplayed.

I know most people are viewing videos such as this to determine what is their best emotional response, and hence whether to comment with cynicism or pleasure based on that response.
But it would be refreshing for some kind of scientist who doesn't care what the outcome will be, but will do their best to study what the actual outcome is and all the factors that lead to that outcome, without all the emotional binary nonsense.

complicated friction making nightmare

Not great for battery life but ....good for an E-MTbike or Cit-E-bike? (or at least you might be able to convince City planning people that they should buy 1000 of them for their CitEbike rollout...maybe) The color of those smaller planetary gears looks like heat treated.... something. Might be bronze I suppose. Not likely brass just based on color. A2 could be a could candidate for wear resistance but poor corrosion resistance. D2 would be great for mat'l price, toughness, corrosion resistance or M2 but they probably don't want them to last "that" long.

I could see how this could have a home in the gravel world. Efficiency losses of 1x setups due to gaps in gearing are probably greater than the 4% figure you have here. But ultimately I think it will come down to compatibility (with existing tech) and reliability (over 1000s of miles of use)

It’s a beautiful design, can’t argue with that. I could see a use case with more performance focused e-bikes which have electric crank drive motors, gravel, mountain e-bikes etc. The efficiency of the chain is quite amazing and the engineering / precision in modern derailleur gears is quite staggering, hard to beat with anything.

If I lost another 10% efficiency, I would be going backwards

I have a still working Hammerschmidt crank and when you are on the geared side of things there is noticeable drag. This is on a mountainbike , just the design of these systems means there is going to be internal losses .

That actually looks like an Edco mono-block cassette. They are about 200.00 US. I use one on my training bike, they work well.

Where did you get 96% from? In their review GCN quoted ~99% for the 0.7 ratio.

I can't understand why manufacturers are so strongly pushing towards removing the front derailleur. We all know the biggest issue in bike transmission is the cross load. The front derailleur is the one and only solution that ensures both a wide range of gears and always keeping the chain as straight as possible.
The usual idea of innovation is to try and improve things.
But in the bike industry, for several years now, the main marketing trend is to sell products that degrade the transmission performance.
The front derailleur has its own problems. The solution is to create a better front derailleur, not to replace it with sh*t.

Also this: high tech fully integrated unserviceable part that goes to the trash bin at the first sign of wear. Against low tech fully serviceable crankset.

So the ring on the outside is the outer ring, and the ring on the inside is the inner ring....thanks that was really confusing lol

Very good video and clear explanations ! I kind of feel that for years "gear box" system have been on the market. Al lot of good system able to replace the standard derailleur system (Pinion, Effigear even Shimano Nexus/Alfine ...) but all with the same issu of efficiency. I'm not sure they all use the same planetary system (?) but they all are less efficient than the derailleur as Classified .So maybe that could be an option for non-competitive cycling ? But then it's too expensive ...

4% is nothing for those that don’t ride around at the limit or want to win races. For anyone with a 1 x set up it offers a very neat way of getting extra gears. Which for a gravel rider or mtb rider could be the difference in getting up a hill or not.

I would guess you could check out the efficiency by running the following test. Have 2 models of the same bike, 1 normal 2x and one 1x with the Classified hub. Run each of them on a cycling treadmill with the same rider riding both bikes, same tyres and tyre pressure, at a standard wattage of say 250 watts measured at the cranks or pedals. You would then be able to see the different speeds and wattages on the treadmill compared to crank watts measurements. This could also be checked in different chainring combinations on the 2x bike to see if that makes a difference.

You dosen't mention two other cons: dosen't work with QR and you can't customize your front gearing if you for example prefer a 36x46 chainring.