Crafting Is (Kinda) Pointless

It is me, Razbuten, back at it with another "This Thing About Video Games Bothers Me" video. I hope you're all doing well, and let me know what you think about crafting. How would you like to see it used in games? Would you even like to see it used in games? Also, how is your day?

"couldn't be bothered" pretty much sums it up

I think one thing that would really help is if items had harsher requirements with greater returns. With this the animations are less frustrating, because you don’t watch them 100,000 times.

I hear crafting system and I lean toward nope out.

I have actually been searching for videos about why inventories are so unrealistic in games (especially RPG) and found this😅 So I think that would be a curious idea for you to consider as for one of your next videos, what you say?

Wild how different our fallout 4 experiences were, what you disliked is what i liked, and i seemed to be encumbered all the time haha

I'm surprised he didn't mention how crafting and specifically material searching could be integrated better he briefly brings it up with subnatica and how you'll most likely be going out to look for something specific and only certain areas will have that material but that's it I mainly bring this up because of one of my personal top games horizon: zero dawn even though it has crafting the material searching is terribly done where you either need stuff that's takes to much effort to get like animal skins and bones or something that's to easy to get but you need to much of like wood or metal shards I found that by the time i have my first or second shadow weapon I normally just buy the material i need there's not much I can think for fixing these issues besides swapping the shop items like wood and other stuff for animal parts as well as making certain plants only grow in certain areas as there is already some of that but it could be better if it was more restricted and the gatherer skill better or even adding a second level to it like the scavenger skill i haven't play forbidden west yet and I've been avoiding spoilers like the plague so i don't know if some of these issues are solved in it or not but i hope they at least somewhat are

Crafting has been a big thing in games since long before minecraft, rpgs in general popularized it but id say mmos and arpgs are the reason they are in so many games not minecraft

This is a very thoughtful video! Thank you!

I’m surprised you didn’t mention The Forest or Resident Evil 0-4. I feel like those have some of the best crafting systems ever

Vintage story, like minecraft, is very crafting focused, but the crafting is very indepth, you have to knapp flint and sgones for your first tools, and eventually actually forge and use a smithy to create your tools, armor, and some other stuff as well

Bro made a whole video about crafting and never mentioned the Atelier Series? The one Jrpg series where crafting is the most important part of the game????

And then.....tears of the kingdom came out and change d EVERYTHINGGG !!!!

I mean, one way to make crafting complex is to have complex production chains, like in Astroneer or Raft

IMO it is just way too much overused. I like it, but not in every game.

The best use of crafting is to make a choice. Limit the supplies so the player must choose what to craft.

Honestly, while I like ACNH, the crafting is a little odd sometimes. No matter what the item is, the character animation is always the same. Even if it's stacked documents, a pile of zen cushions, or medicine.

Go play Vintage Story, or some hardcore Minecraft mod.
Crafting is kind of pointless, because games never really balance for it properly.

I actively acoid games with crafting in them if its the main progression system.

Never really crafted in any of the AAA "rpgs". Seems useless and tedious.

I have never played God of War (and probably never will) but I always thought that you obtain new weapons in the game by progressing with the story or something

At least in Fallout New Vegas, crafting is completely optional, that the game doesn't force you to use it to progress a quest, but, it can be quite a powerful tool for making your builds stronger or for the early game if you need stuff as an added option that isn't mandatory.

When I realized that battle items could knock enemies over in persona 5 the crafting activity became much more valuable, especially because you have limited opportunities to buy them

I hate how they ruined Farcry 6 with crafting mechanics that nobody wanted.

The minigame that best works for crafting, in my opinion, is (unsurprisingly) Minecraft's. Arrange the materials in a pattern where the pattern AND materials are important to making a Thing.

I also think this could be used for more than JUST crafting. Imagine a superhero game where procedurally-generated missions are "investigations" that the players are doing. You get yourself a cork board with red string that you can upgrade with more space, or to a crime computer, or something else, and you collect "clue" items as one of the things on other missions or when out beating up random thugs as grinding activity. Then, you put the clues together to generate some of the seeds or bounds for the randomizer that puts together your procedurally-generated mission/quest/whatever! Instead of reading the newspaper or talking to a random guy in a bar or on a street corner, the narrative is that your PC has "discovered" a plot by piecing together his clues, and now has to go thwart it!

Even Factorio's "crafting" is a recipe based combination of stuff.
The only "real crafting" I found in Factorio was the Space mod which had me tinkering around with logic gates to store energy in steam tanks to fuel the protective dome against the solar eruptions.
Factorio's main gameplay isn't about crafting, it's about optimization.

If you had cold called me and asked me whether Fallout 4 had crafting, I wouldn't have had a sure answer.

It is getting out of control now. I'm so sick of "crafting" games. Oh, you mean we can't make a good game so instead we will just make it take longer to get the things you need!

I think there's a few different ways you can make crafting work. The thing that made Minecraft so rewarding in the early days was when you were able to memorise all the different crafting recipes, you felt like you were developing, learning and surviving. The fact that you didn't just need the items, but needed to put the items in the right configuration made it feel like a really engaging part of the game. Modern Minecraft doesn't have this anymore, but there are now so many items that I can also understand why the recipe book exists.

Another game I genuinely think did crafting well but for a different reason was Subnautica. Every craft had a purpose, almost every item in the game has genuine serious value. Not only that, but many of the items available for crafting are locked behind scavenging for fragments so that your system can actually figure out what is needed to create the item or vehicle or tool. More advanced tools and vehicles require fragments that are in more dangerous areas, therefore when you finally get the recipe and are able to craft the thing you wanted, it in itself feels like a serious achievement. That's something you don't get with a lot of crafting games, for most games the success feeling comes from when you use the item, whereas in Subnautica you already feel the success just from managing to craft the thing.

EDIT: I should've finished the video before commenting, but glad to see you also think Subnautica is a glowing example!

I love how he uses music from Rdr2 in his videos

Hasn't warcraft worn this game mechanic of crafting into the ground?

Now waiting for your review on totk. Your vid on botw hits the nails so looking forward to your totk one.

Good god this guy only plays the most popular slop

My eyes glaze over when I discover the game has crafting.... such a waste of time, unless it's a survival type of game--when it actually makes sense

These vids are ok, but I think they usually can always be summed up with the same thing you say yourself in them: "in my experience"

Idk how many times I've thought the same way as you in some of these games and then turned around and watched my family or friends play and see that they do craft or use items I would never bother with, often times with awesome results.

These work really good for looking at how YOU tend to enjoy games and the lens you use while playing them. But unfortunately it often feels like you're presenting some sort of evidence or fact, when in reality it's just your opinions and anecdotes.

I like them though, thanks for putting the time into making them.

Not sure if he brings it up but who else crafts consumables, never uses them cause there is always a “better moment and I don’t want to waste them” and never use them

Watching this video reminded me of why I love the crafting in Fantasy Life for the 3ds so much. Granted, I think the game overall is phenomenal, but loving something hasn't stopped me from criticizing it, too (looking at YOU One Piece), and I gotta say. I genuinely love the crafting system/minigame in Fantasy Life. ❤️

Watching this after totk 2 years later is crazy

Dark Messiah had some really satisfactory smithing

A game that I like the way it does it, is Dragon Quest Builders.
For while there is some craftings that are simply en-masse, there are also some that are important and engaged, with the story, current mission and etc. We go out of the base getting ready and specifically towards a quest or for gathering specific materials.

Crafting is dumb. In general. It's very hard to justify its presence in the game. Too little of it and it's pointless. Too much and it becomes a pain in the ass. As you said - in a lot of games it can easily be replaced by money and nothing will change.

Games where it makes sense are built around it. Like survival games or some RPGs.
In cyberpunk it's completely useless imho. You craft a weapon or armor and 10 minutes later you get a better one from the dead enemy or out of the container.
It's a bit more complicated when it comes to ammo because honestly - I like being able to choose which ammo to craft when I need it. But at the same time - it might as well just drop from enemies and be scattered around the world or I could just fast travel to a shop to buy it.
Also there's an immersive part. I really doubt you can make a pistol bullet outside of workshop with just two units of powder or something like that. But I could imagine crafting a shittier version of shotgun ammo with toolkit, empty shells, powder, old book/torn shirt and ball bearings.
But making believable crafting system is very hard. It's very tedious in real life and doesn't fit into a game. Also there's a problem of tools and resources. It's dumb to have one-use pliers and using two cans of powder to craft just 5 bullets and its even more dumb to have 9999 pickable tools scattered around the world when the player only needs one if you don't have any trading system.

I normally conserve everythin my first playthrough since I only use them for real difficulty walls and would never want to go without if I actually needed it. Then by my second playthrough I've been forced to get so good that I never need them unless somehow it makes things noticably quicker. I only start crafting at the endgame normally if I even remember to.

I think the Atelier games have my favorite crafting systems. Sophie 1's in particular I've liked out of the two I've tried I really love because of the little puzzle game you play with the ingredients. Which makes the kinds of ingredients you pick to use not just a matter of grade qualities and what the items do, but also one of "Can I even fit this shit in the grid?"

But like I think the main thing I like so much about the Atelier games beyond just being games based around crafting that have actually interesting crafting is that you aren't a big fancy adventuring hero or something. You're an alchemist and you're doing alchemist things. While there is combat systems in the games and while Ayesha does have more plot stakes than several of the other games you are still just an alchemist. And that, I think, matters more to me than the fun exploration progression loop of Subnautica, as much as I love it. Because I like being able to play as an alchemist. And that I think is what I ultimately want most out of crafting systems. I want to roleplay as someone who can do a skill.

I've literally played 2 long playtroughs of Cyberpunks story + sidemissions without using the crafting system even once. A lot of these massive open world games have crafting and material systems that feel just plain useless or unnecessary, or even worse, like a chore. Often they are only relevant if you want to play a specific playstyle or if you really want to min/max certain character abilities, which are both not my type of playing a game. I'm more a "play what comes natural to me" type of guy, so if crafting doesn't feel like a core mechanic that i need or want I don't really use it.

Don't get me wrong, i'm definetly not generally against crafting, i love Games where it's well done or the core gameplay loop like the almighty Minecraft or Games like Valheim and I personally loved the basebuilding in Fallout 4 because it had so much potential to create something unique, where you almost feel like roleplaying even if I'm not really a roleplayer in games. I just don't like that it's just normal to have a crafting system nowadays in games, even if it doesn't contribute anything to the main gameplay loop or experience of the game/world.

Kingdom come deliverance has some of the best crafting in a game I’ve played. Can’t recommend that game enough.

Crafting was the thing that really made me hate Horizon Zero Dawn.

XIVs is pretty relaxing as you sit among adventurers going on their way or hunting out bosses for the next batch if its something rarer.

Ff14 best crafting in any game ANY GAME

I’m still trying to craft a lvl 50 high quality piece of fukn lumber….