Mûmakil/Oliphaunts of Middle-earth (& How Hobbits Knew About Them)

Were mumakil present at the sack of Edoras when Helm fled to the Suthburg? There is some art out there with mumakil featured in the combined Dunlending/southern army. There's also rumors they will appear in War of the Rohirrim later this year.

Hobbits didnt avoid larger Men in their early days. In fact they always set up shop next to settlements of Men. They depended on the work such societies provided. So in light of that oliphant stories are likely second hand accounts.

What? No traveling circuses in Middle Earth?

It's a very good theory that Hobbits used to live in the south where Mûmakil were a native species but I wonder then what made them decide to go all the way north to the Vale of Anduin.

While not the size of the Mûmakil depicted in the LOTR movies, there was a genus of Elephant, Palaeoloxodon, some of the species of which grew to well over twice the size of the African Elephant. One of these species, Palaeoloxodon antiquus, was native to Europe and its range at its peak included southern Great Britain. I wonder if Tolkien was aware of these elephants when he came up with the Mûmakil.

they could have heard it from Gandalf or visiting Rangers

Waiting for an Oliphaunt with 3 Ca§tles on his back
(heraldic joke)

Did Hobbits know about them or did they just have some old folklore with giant beasts they called Oliphants that happened to be similar in appearance to Mumakil?

we know that African elephants are smaller than they were and that mammoth were considerably bigger. there is archeological evidence for the African elephant being "tamed" and used for war. i think they were the ancestors of African elephants and like the ents, elves and the sacred spaces they lived in, have faded

You forget that Gandalf gave stories and lore to frodo and I assume other young Hobbits.

I loved mumakil in BfME.

Man, the Oliphaunts are a sight to see...And thankful, Sam and Frodo got to see them for us to imagine and see for ourselves!!!
Thanks Mellon for this Video about the Oliphaunts, Until Gothmog and whatever he was adaptation wise... because, I don't know also Marion Baggins Out!!!

Amazing vid! I was wondering, could you make a video of if there was any evil hobbits, that joined Sauron. If you have not already

Yoystan: Hobbits lived nowhere near Harad.
Amazon: Gimme that keyboard! (tap tap tap tappity tap) "It was a cold and dreary morning when life began stirring in the Hobbit community of Toadbottom in eastern Harad ..."

😍😍😍✅✅✅

By the way, Oliphaunt is pronounced the exact same as Olifant, the Dutch word for Elephant.

But the answer could be the simplest one: Bree. Especially in the early Third Age, Bree was where one heard all the news and tales. Dwarves, messengers between Arnor and Gondor, Dwarves, and what not gathering at the Inn and exchanging news and tales. Surely the earliest Hobbit residents of Bree heard these tales, as well as the comings and goings between the Shire and Bree in the mid to later Third Age. "It was not yet forgotten that there once was much coming and going between the Shire and Bree".

I had always assumed that they had the storys from the ppls of old Arnor who would have known of them or at least storys of them so that would have spread to the Hobbits of those days

Gimli "That still only counts as one!"

Maybe I’m missing a linguistic detail but I always thought oliphaunt was the least creative name for a creature of middle earth. But that could be my own lack of understanding!

Look mr Frodo it’s an oliphaunt

Bilbo probably heard about Oliphants on his travels and wrote the poem and Sam learnt it while Mr Bilbo taught him his letters.

I think it was short-sighted to destroy the mumakil. They could have been used to do so much work rebuilding Minas Tirith. I’m sure that’s how they’re used at home. The pow’s could demonstrate how to control them.
Also, they’re probably edible and the ones killed in battle could be preserved to feed the people since the farms of the Pelennor were ruined. I can hear kids complaining, “Not mumakil for dinner again!”

Think what Hobbits lived near a battle that Mumakil were use . Back in Smeagol's day .

Yeah too bad when King Ellisor came N to take his claim of the Northern Kingdom he didn't bring any oil offense with him just to prove that Sam Wise Gamgee is not a liar and he is no fib teller No tall Taylor and that they exist And everybody in the Shire or beef flabbergasted They would come from miles around to see this these creatures Hello we were nice with Ellis R had done that just for Sam you know like thank you sam for being such a loyal convenient of Frodo i'm fulfilling a wish dream come true of yours to prove to the rest of the shire folks that all fans are real. That would have been awesome And a cool way to end Sam's story before he goes over the West

Weta made a large slain prop mumak at almost the last minute, much to Weta staff's consternation, on request by the director Peter Jackson. It appears in the scene where Peregrin Took enters the field and locates the dazed and disoriented Meriadoc Brandybuck after his experience with Eowyn in successful slaying the Witch-king of Angmar. The prop became a favorite picnic destination for crew members.

Stories could easily have come via travelling dwarves and rangers stopping at Bree, where hobbits from The Shire (especially Brandybucks and Tooks) ventured occasionally to pick up news from Bree (which isn't sure as Shiretalk).
I have a little fanfiction story in my head about a young (and sympathetic) Haradrim oliphaunt handler who goes to war to ensure his favourite beast is treated well... he's the one Sam sees clinging to the oliphaunt's neck as it runs wild in Ithilien (they escape and live quietly in the wild, wanting to avoid war).

No one back home will believe this.

New theory video idea: What if the Barrow-wight slayed the Hobbits and took The One Ring?

Headcanon:
The fact that Aragorn managed to make peace with the Haradrim as High King Elessar, this means that Aragorn could've employed the Mumakil into his army when he and Eomer decided to kick some Easterling asses. 😅

Maybe hobbits can read books?

I love the hobbit speculation. I never really thought about it but is really fun to theorize about how they knew them

I believe the Dragon's would have something to say about Size and Power!!! 🔥🤠👍

I’ve been waiting for this video since you suggested it in the polls months ago! Thank you!

There are southern people, both refugees and suspicious people, passing through Bree and people telling stories about wars abroad in the early chapters of Fellowship of the Ring. Frodo hears lots of it. It's not a big stretch for there to be other people from the south visiting during more peaceful times or during one of Gondor's previous wars with the south.

The elephants that Hannibal and other North African generals used were not the African elephants we know of today--they were a different species that is now extinct. They were captured and used in wars until there were none left. Tolkien is likely to have known this, though the war elephant species from history were smaller than African elephants of today, not larger like oliphaunts.

Is it not possible that Oliphaunts like many other creatures were changed and corrupted by Sauron? Like orcs, or wolves, or spiders, or dragons? I assume hobbits knew about oliphaunts because most of them could read.

Awesome video as always!

I always find it weird how people of today always believe that ancient societies were clueless about things outside of their own region. Just because there was no instant news, radio, TV or Internet stories and news would spread. Travelling bards, merchants, sailors would bring news from far away countries to different communities. The news may be at times diluted and exaggerated but news would still travel and people would heard of these different lands, cultures.

Oliphant was the old anglo-norman word for elephant

Maybe it was stories shared by Bilbo

The Greeks, Romans, and Carthinigians, used elephants for logistics and psychological reasons. The Greeks favored Asian elephants, which were large enough to carry towers with a few archers. Hannibal preferred smaller North African elephants, not African Elephants proper, so they could traverse harsh terrain, but only had one rider. The relationships of intelligent elephants created a problem. If an elephant received an injury, not only would it lash out or trample friend or foe, other elephants would often react empathetically and do the same.

I agree. From an " Evolutionary" perspective ( it's fantasy after all), we have seen many examples of organisms changing body size to adapt to new conditions, what ever they may be. Too bad Sam never got to see an Ent, he saw Olyphants and Elves. He was practically a Crypto Zoologist! 🤣🕊️

Mumakils vs Dragons?

I can't help but wonder if Oliphaunts used to exist around the area of the Shire at one point as the Hobbit breeds migrated to those lands. I think there were even stories about the Ent-Wives in their area, but I could be misremembering that too.

if a traveler encounters something unknown, they usually adopt the local term instead of making up a new one. For example, the first European who encountered a certain fruit the natives called "Ananas" they didn't bother coming up with a new name and just default to a slight variation. Except for the Brit who insisted to call it a pineapple.
So linguistically it would make sense that Hobbit learned of Mumakil independently from the people who call them Mumakil

Didn't Tolkein ever say anything about the Mumakil in any of his collected letters?

If this exists already, I'd love to know, but a collab of sorts between you and In Deep Geek would be awesome.

👍👍👍

Is there any info about what the evil men of Rhun and Harad thought of Mordor itself? they were living in Mordor, during the war of the ring, I can't imagine it was a fun experience.