Wharfedale 12.1 Budget Bookshelf Speaker with “Laid Back” sound but output limited.

Just got a pair of these for $200.00 about a month ago on a black friday deal. Wow, quite neutral and VERY listenable. The dip I eq'ed and while it seems more accurate with EQ, still love how the dip was implemented overall. I do not seem to have much issue with it not playing loud enough or compression, but I tend to use moderately loud only.

Are these too laid back for a 2.1 home theater set up? I know they're good with music which is important but what about movies?

On UK Amazon these speakers sell for $314 you're paying to import them if the looks make you better about ok but they are a $300ish speaker

Excellent

I own a pair of diamond 9.1 speakers, i can honestly say for their size they have Colossal sound with bass easily hitting 37hz, they are incredible

Never heard these. From Your description sounds like the cheaper alternative to the Wharfedale Denton 80th. Owned a pair for two years or so. Laidback and not much attack. Don’t misunderstand, they didn’t do anything really wrong just not exciting. Really want to try the Linton but my past Wharfedale experience gives me pause.

Don’t push the idea that everything “should” be monitor accurate. It’s a great speaker for people that want to enjoy music all day without fatigue. Karl heinz fink implemented that dip on purpose to make it more pleasant. Take the Dali opticon for example, it’s impressive but after 20-30 minutes the sheer bite and snap becomes tiring.

Aren't the woofers in this series weirdly small? From pictures side by side with other speakers, it seems like the 12.1s "5-inch" woofer is closer to a typical 4-inch.. and the 12.2 seems closer to a typical 5-inch..

So I don't think i would consider anything smaller than the 12.2..

Did you find the woofer to look a bit undersized for spec?

I'm about to order these speakers for a desktop system to pair with a SMS l a s 300. That's what I have the money for so that's what I'm going to do lol. I'm a big fan of the BBC dip simply because those areas that it tends to decrease tend to be the most fatiguing. But just like noses because I also review fragrances and things on this channel that I'm commenting on or from, everybody's ears a little bit different. Excellent review by the way. I think this will make an excellent pairing especially with a digital amp because they can tend to be on occasion a little bit overbearing. This one however has received good reviews and it doesn't seem to have any of the shrill characteristics that accompany some digital amplifiers. Eventually I will upgrade but I think these speakers will last me for the next 10 years no problem

to me the looks are its worse feature!

If you haven't got a big room they sound great. Especially with the SVS Subwoofer.

Your right, a little laid back. I know I can trust you! (UPDATE: 6/18/23) After about 10 hours of 85 dB break-in they have opened up a bit in the midrange. Still slightly laid back, but very enjoyable.

Great Review Erin. I appreciate the detail and in-depth explanation. Quick question ---Would it make a good surround sound speaker? You said rolling it off at 80 Hz helps the speaker - check one. You suggested making it more nearfield - check 2. Would compression be an issue for it being used as a surround sound speaker? Love to hear your take. Thanks again and keep up the good work...

I think I will go with q acoustics 3050’s. What do u think?

What happens if it's placed with its back to the wall?

That "laid back" makes these so great. For bookshelf speakers in this price range, they are pretty amazing. I could listen to them all day and not get fatiqued listening to them. I feel you have to take the price of the speaker, and the fact they are smaller bookshelf/stand speakers, into account when doing a review. These are a really great speaker, and so many other reviews are quite positive about them :). Of course my comment is my reflection and view only :)
I appreciate your view point though. I think sometimes a harder review can put all the great ones into perspective. 100% you do need a sub with most speakers this size. They actually match really well with the Wharfedale diamond SWxxx subs. I ahve used them with a SW150 and can get a really nice presence in the low end.

I love the look at all the technical details helping people decide based on strengths and weaknesses. Problem is it makes most speakers look worse than they are in reality. But yeah sub-1000 speakers all tend to have some noticeable issues.

Imagine having that kippels nearfield scanner for diy speaker building. Thats my dream! Have you built any speakers your self Erin?

I am hoping you will do a full review of the modern reincarnations Falcon ls3/5a since these are legendary in the hifi community. Is it just hype?

To me that dip sounds “muffled”

Hi this is Naveen thakur from india .i love your videos.plz help me to choose between KEF r3 or wharfedale linton. You have listened both.plz tell me which one is better sounding speaker between 2. The only thing metter for me is sound

So many reviewers have reviewed and measured 12.1, while so many potential buyer wish to have real measurements of 12.2. There is NO new information reveled in this review unfortunately. Neally all bookshelf speakers with a single 5.25 inch woofer have limited output. No one should expect to play at 90 db with low distortion. While bookshelf speaker with a single 6.5 inch woofer will provide at least 3 db more sensitivity or output potential with much lower distortion.

Then, the Elac B6.2 has similar dip around crossover point (frankly most 2ways using LR4 do), but it's tuned slightly brighter overall.
Generally many British spkrs were more on the laid back side, other than the popular B&W.
Myself, I rather go with warmer than bright and sterile. But 12.1 compression test is somewhat disappointing, even for a 5" cone.

Introductory sounds awesome 😂😂😂😂😂

I used to have a Wharfedale 225 and it was the same way. When a chorus hit in a pop song there was just no energy. It just sounded dull and soft.

LOVE the Trumpet change up !! 🙏🙏🤘👍🏻.. Keep it coming.

I really like these mabey not as my only pair of speakers but ever since the 220 and even way back to the diamond 8.1 liked wharfedale . These reviews are getting better n better your starting to hit your groove and style.

Just a suggestion ... you talked about the finish and build quality being good - but you didn't show it !

Maybe a minute or so looking at the speaker itself ? !

Update- Diamonds are all on sale at Crutchfield right now. The 12.1s, regularly $449, are $299 in white and $349 in all other colors, and the 12.2s, regularly $599, are $399 in white and $449 in the other colors. This leads me to question if they're being replaced by a newer Diamond line, because I've never seen them go on sale before.

@Erin’s Audio Corner
The more I watch these videos the more I appreciate how much you can learn from the data for if anything, optimally setting your speakers up and/or tweaking them with eq.

If you boosted a pair of speakers without the ‘bbc dip’ in the 1k-3k range by 3dB would it improve clarity? Are there any negative effects?

Have you ever thought about doing a range of videos showing us how we could measure our own speakers with REW to get pseudo results like yours? It would be an interesting watch.

My wife prefers a BBC dip.

Hi Erin just want to say i love your reviews in general but your recent reviews i have particularly enjoyed and appreciated because they have all been speakers that have been reviewed before by others and i have seriously considered purchasing myself so i really appreciate your knowledge and expertise. I actually own the Elac B6.2s for about a year and i absolutely love them. But the opinions have been so varied that i have considered purchasing other speakers to see if it is possible to get a better sound at a similar price. I actually considered the Jamo C93 2's and the Wharfdales 12.1 based on other reviewers like Cheapaudioman and there is another English gentleman whose name and channel i don't quite recall at the moment but i remember he spoke very favourably of the Wharfdales for a budget speaker and he usually reviews much higher end equipment. So when you reviewed all three in such a short space of time was like you were reading my mind.. But my take based on your reviews, and correct me if i am wrong, is that i should stick to what i have and there is no need to change as neither speaker is better than the Elac. You are one of the most trusted voices in this space if not the most trusted so continue to shine.👍👍

It's annoying to see and endless series of speakers with directivity mismatching issues. Hey guys, lets make another speaker with a big mid woofer and cross it at 5k! /s

The diamond series is way too muted not much top end

Your vids are the best man, I really enjoy when you break all that chit down. As far as the speaker goes, at least it looks decent and isn't screaming in your face. A very good explanation of what this speaker is all about and how to get the best sound out of it.

What do you expect from a 5 inch mid bass...

I've found most Wharfedale products have some sort of "laid back" sound to them

Sounds like a hard no for home theater. Speaking of which, have you heard the PSA bookshelves? I'm looking for a high sensitivity sealed speaker for home theater and they aren't crazy expensive.

450 usd? man you guys get a bad deal on these... they retail at £250 here (translates to roughly $300) wonder if that would effect your thoughts on them? I definitely wouldnt buy them at 450... Personally, I dont think these really class as a budget product though, I'm listening through a set of wharfedale diamond 9.0 bookshelfs which at retail cost only £60 ($71) paired with the wharfedale diamond SW150 which cost £150 ($177.50) and that is a truly impressive budget setup for the £210 ($250) total that it cost.

@Erin's Audio Corner Do any passive speakers compete with the Kali LP6v2 or Kali IN5/8 in their respective price categories for overall sound quality-especially in regards to dynamics, bass extension and neutrality?

In my experience with Diamond 10.1, while a very nice speaker to listen to, don't think it's quite as good as the Kali with a sub, and not even close without.

I also have the Jamo C95 which I bought primarily based on appearance/WAF in a living room setup and while I good smile curve Speaker again the Kali is better overall and I'm sure the IN5/8 would crush it if I had to guess.

I'm considering another set of living room speakers and think the Kali LP6v2 and IN5/8 look quite nice or the absolutely sexy Monitor Audio Bronze 100. Wife likes the look of both with a slight preference to Monitor Audio, but with prices similar I wonder if the Monitor Audio Bronze even has a chance, let alone the silver with any of the Kalis?

The day I unsub is the day you stop making silly sounds with your voice. That's why I'm here, oh and the data I suppose.

I have speakers with an intentional midrange dip (Classix II DIY) and I agree, it's not really a good thing to implement. I have found myself looking to correct with some xover mods.

Speaker turn roundy round. Is good!

This, to me, just looks like a crossover region that isn't quite right, so they are down in the crossover, rather than summing together level. Most likely just needs some crossover tweaking. Does wharfedale have tools like this? If not, this may have looked a bit different to them when they sent it for production

I like the bbc dip in iems, but I want my speakers flat. The 12.2 cost only 40 euros more (380E) where I live , so that seems like a nice option.

I believe this dip is intentional and perhaps a signature for the 12.x series (and Linton?). I owned the 12.2 and 12.4. Both shared a similar (easygoing) midrange that mitigates lesser recordings. Often resulting in a more 'natural' sound. Both 12.2 and 12.4 are ofcourse more mature speakers, where the 12.1 is most likely limited by its size. I do like the fact however, based on your findings, that they maintained their relaxed soundsignature and quality in materials.

I asked for it. And i got it
Review of these i mean

Too expensive. You might as well spend another $150 and get the much better 12.2

Karl-Heinz Fink has indeed stated that the dip was intentional or his ears would bleed... lol! Even the Lintons have the dip, just to a lesser extent. Seem like a trend, especially the newer Wharfedales. I own the 12.2 and I personally liked it better than the R200. I bought the Schiit Lokius which has a 2khz knob and as I increase that region even by 2db, some female vocals will start sounding bright and the overall sound loses a bit of depth. Increase it more than 2db and things start to get harsh. I know it isnt accurate but it is very pleasant to listen to. Besides that 1-3khz dip, it looks very neutral everywhere else. Laidback is the right word, but its not 'soft' either.

There has been questions in ASR asking why is there a peak at 12khz on your measuremwnts when Amir's measurement do not show such a peak. What do you think is making such a difference? Mic?

I'm not sure that could really be called the "BBC dip". I think the BBC dip is supposed to a be a dip in the on-axis response to compensate from a peak in that area of the FR in the off-axis response, but your listening window curve show a dip as well in that area, when it should be flatter. Well, that was on interpretation of the reasons behind the "BBC dip" - there are others... 🙂